Optimized export setting for Laptop and FHD 60FPS video

Hi,
i would like to ask what’s the best setup for my videos:

Panasonic Lumix G85 with 12-60mm G-vario Lens
Wireless Rhode Mic
FHD 60FPS
4:3-ratio
shooted with tripod
topic: wellness/fitness
They will be uploaded on a private youtube channel first, but then eventually on a private platform with a different player and video store on Amazon Cloud probably. Video will be watched mainly on pc and maybe on Tv.

i have a laptop:

Lenovo Yoga 710 15kb with Nvidia Geforce 940mx
i’m expanding the ram to 16gb.
screenshot.41

thanks a lot!

if you want an example of the video, just let me know.

PS: changing PC is not an option now. thanks :slight_smile:

I have two G85 cameras that I still regularly use, so I can get you any settings you need. However, if you have plans to submit these videos to a video store on Amazon Cloud, are you absolutely absolutely absolutely sure the store accepts 60fps video? I would be surprised if they did.

Even if the store accepts 60fps video, is there an advantage to using it? Exercise videos do not contain enough high action movement to need high frame rate. Using 60fps will require a faster shutter speed, which requires more light on the set to get the same exposure. But you’re using a lens that starts at f3.5, so gathering enough light could be a challenge. If you have enough light and just want that specific look, then very well.

My main concern is that FHD 60fps on a G85 is only a 28Mbps codec. It looks quite bad and does not edit well due to the heavy compression. The color information is simply not there, and color grading cannot be pushed far without artifacts.

The final product would look radically better if captured in 4K 30fps at 100Mbps, and exported at 1080p if the video store doesn’t accept 4K. The higher bitrate codec makes a world of difference in image quality and color grading ability. Since you’re bumping up to 16 GB RAM, your laptop can handle it. Proxies take care of the editing lag. Being “stuck” at 30fps also means slower shutter speed, making it much easier to get enough light and avoid high ISO noise.

Based on the format you choose (60fps vs 4K), I can recommend export settings from there.

@Austin thanks a lot for your kins answer!!! i know this is a long answer, but i’m learning and willing to challange myself and get good confrontation and advises from you guys :). so thanks!!!

So, the videos will be share before through Patreon an uploaded for now either on Youtube (private link) or as suggested by Patreon itself on Streamable, Vidyard or something similar. (Vimeo is expensive). Eventually I will create my own website platform VOD during the next year, and have to decide if use a VOD platform, Amazon AWS as some web designer suggested, or again something like Streamable.

I followed your advice and shot some videos in 4k 30fps, and also FHD 30 and 60.
I must say that I actually notice the following differences:

  • 4k colours are more clear and also have so much more the details on the scene (ie. my face etc.)

  • 1080 60fps it’s visibly more fluid especially when I do body movement and transition (especially in dynamic yoga classes).

  • 1080 30fps same video quality but less smooth.
    also

  • 4k create monstrous files. for about 60min of videos I have about 40/50 gigabytes of file, which gimme issue in terms of space and how to store it. it’s not only that, these giant files required a lot of times to be copied from one place to another, and a lot of time to be proxied. in FHD I realized I can work without proxies. So even if I was for 4k I have to admit I don’t have the equipment yet to manage it quickly, considering that most of my videos are from 60 to 75 min each. (it’s a yoga class). Eventually, if the business is successful i’d like to go 4k 60fps.

  • in terms of light, for now I’m shooting in two places which seem OK: one outside in the yard, in the morning with decent light (I’m in Miami for now) and indoor in an empty living room, using 2 standing light with 4 bulbs each, which seem to be doing a decent job.

I’m really interested in your mention of the G85 having a 28mbps codec. I noticed that checking the properties of my videos. in the following video tutorial the guy is suggesting setting it to set the Mbps to 40 or 50mbps for a 60fps video. as it said 100 for a 4k. I just did some test with many exporting settings on a short video, but I haven’t reviewed them yet.

B-frame: confusing topic. I heard 2 it’s enough. shotcut often offers me three most of the time. I read the highest the better, but i noticed it makes the file much bigger and haven’t notice much of a difference honestly. The guys from the video suggested 2.

thanks for your support. greatly appreciated.
i’d be glad to show you the test I made if you are OK at having a look at them.
anyway a short summary on the best settings to export in

4k 30fps
4k 60fps (for future reference) and
FHD 60fps would be greatly appreaciated.

all this numbers are driving me crazy :slight_smile: and i need to find a good setting i can stick with and put my effort on another aspect of the job.

best,
Alessandro

I was just thinking of you and your project earlier today while shooting with my G85, and here you are! Give me a couple of days to get back home to a computer and I’ll write something up for you.

sureee :slight_smile: i’m so blessed indeed to receive such a support. it’s a big things for me. this project i’m doing, hopefully will be a game changer for me and my family.

Hi Alessandro,

Sorry it has taken me so long to get back to you. We had a national holiday in the United States last weekend and I was out longer than expected.

Starting from the beginning…

Producing a series of videos for an online store requires a consistent output format, so it will be critical for you to explicitly set the Video Mode of each project before adding clips to the timeline. Using the “Automatic” default setting could lead to unexpected variations. See:

Match the video mode to your recording format.

Once the project is built and you’re ready to export, here is a configuration that will work for you regardless of which recording format you choose on the G85:

Start with the “H.264 High Profile” preset and begin customizing the Advanced panels as shown in the picture. The items in red are the only ones requiring modification depending on your recording format:

  • Resolution: Should be auto-filled by the project video mode
  • Frames/sec: Should be auto-filled by the project video mode
  • GOP: Use 240 for 60fps. Use 150 for 30fps.

Once you’ve settled on a G85 recording format and the associated export settings, the export configuration can be saved as a custom preset by clicking the “+” Plus sign in the Preset panel. Then the custom preset can be used to export every video to ensure consistent results.

Rationale for these export settings (if curious):

Your videos are an hour in length and you’re using a laptop. Therefore, I recommended H.264 as the video codec because it encodes significantly faster than other options like HEVC or VP9. If encoding HEVC takes 12 hours (using Slow preset), that’s 12 hours you would be unable to edit the next video, and 12 hours lost if there was a mistake that needed to be fixed and exported again. H.264 would only take 2 hours. (Proportionally speaking … actual results may vary).

The recommendation you found of 40-50Mbps bitrate for 1080p is a good one for high-quality sources. However, I haven’t been able to get a G85 (in any 1080p mode) to get remotely close to 40Mbps even after filters are applied. The base codec is only 28Mbps after all. So, forcing an encode to use 40-50Mbps wastes space for picture detail that will never exist. Using CRF 16 (quality 68%) will produce a visually lossless image at the lowest bitrate for that quality level, which will be under 40Mbps on a G85. This is ideal for you… it’s the smallest size at high-quality settings, meaning no wasted space.

If you recorded in 4K, we have the opposite problem. The Shotcut GUI in Constrained VBR mode only allows up to 99Mbps to be entered as a bitrate, and the buffer field won’t allow enough digits to provide one second of buffer at 99Mbps. 80Mbps is the highest bitrate that allows one second of buffer to be specified. These bitrates are too low for a H.264 master at 4K. 30fps needs 100Mbps and 60fps needs 150Mbps. I did visual quality tests and the difference between 100Mbps and 80Mbps is visually noticeable in the form of smearing in textured or noisy areas. Therefore, we need to stick to standard VBR mode to get the bitrate we need for a 4K master, and CRF 16 is again a great solution. @shotcut Is there a technical limitation to widening the Constrained VBR text entry fields to hold an additional digit?

4K workflow possibilities:

I know you tried 4K and felt that the video wasn’t as smooth as 60fps, and the files were huge. My workflow has always been 4K for reasons listed already, and there are tweaks that could possibly make it work for you too. The advantages would be the enhanced color and detail you noticed in your tests.

Let’s start with the first problem. Smoothness is a combination of two factors: frame rate and shutter speed. Sometimes, people say “it doesn’t look smooth” but what they’re really seeing is too much motion blur if they are used to 60fps video games or YouTube videos. In that case, it’s more about reducing blur than it is having more frames per second. So, a possible test is to do 4K 30fps again but change the shutter speed to something higher that’s between 1/60th and 1/125th. It may be that 1/80th or 1/100th reduces enough blur (without causing strobing) that the video looks “crisp” again, which is sometimes what people mean when they say “smooth”. If there are a lot of fast movements, then 30fps may not accomplish the 60fps look no matter what, but it might be worth another test to be sure.

The easiest camera configuration in your scenario might be to put the G85 into “Creative Movie” mode which gives you full control. Set the mode dial on top of the camera to the icon of an “M” with a movie camera beside it. Then go to the menu and set the exposure mode to Shutter priority as shown in the picture below. If the ISO is also set to Auto, then all that’s left to do is set the shutter speed to a value you wish to test, and the camera does everything else. Compare different shutter speeds to see if motion looks smoother or crisper.

ShutterPriority

As for workflow, when file transfers are done over an entirely USB 3 or faster chain (meaning USB 3 card reader, USB 3 hub, USB 3 computer, USB 3 external hard drive), then transfer rates are 80+ MB/sec, and a 50GB file takes around 10 minutes to transfer. This has never been a show-stopper in my workflow. To get these speeds, a Class 10/U3/V30 or better SD card is required. I use these:

If data is written to a 4TB external hard drive, then 3.5TB (usable space) divided by 50GB per video is 70 videos on a single drive. Factor in proxies and exports, and that’s around 45-ish videos. That’s a lot of videos for a not-terribly-expensive but high-quality drive like this one:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00ZTRXFBA/

For completeness, I use these models of SD card reader and USB hub:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B009D79VH4/

Given that you will be spending days of effort making multiple videos as a business venture, you’d need two hard drives to keep a backup of your work in case one drive fails or is damaged or lost. Nobody wants to lose their entire business because of an accident that could have been mitigated with a $100 drive. For this same reason, it wouldn’t be recommended to store video on the internal C: drive of the laptop.

Back to the workflow … My workflow is to capture video of an event, go home, copy files from SD cards to the hard drive, then start generating proxies. I let the proxies generate overnight while I’m sleeping. The next day, I’m rested with a clear mind for a big edit session that goes really smooth thanks to proxies, then I export the final project overnight. Everything is done the next morning. This means I get a 4K master with a two-day delay from the recording date. This is perfectly fine for larger productions that don’t have a daily delivery schedule to meet. After all, the customer cares about final quality, not production logistics.

This is my concern … the appeal of recording in 1080p from the G85 is that editing can be done without proxies. However, that might only be true if zero filters are applied. Once size & position filters are added for overlay graphics and then multi-track compositing begins, playback will probably start to stutter even at 1080p, especially at 60fps. We haven’t even got to white balance and contrast and sharpness and other filters yet. Filters are hard work for a computer. It is very much worth testing a 1080p clip with a finalized set of filters on it and evaluating the playback speed before concluding “1080p is the way to go simply because it edits faster”. It may not be faster with filters applied. If that advantage is gone and proxies become required even for 1080p, then why not attempt 4K since the workflow is now the same? (This assumes 4K 30fps could achieve the smooth look you want.)

Despite the sound of it, I am not advising a 4K production. That decision is up to you. I’m simply describing a proven workflow and listing the pros and cons of both formats so you have all the information available before making a decision.

Best of luck to you! Let me know if you need anything else.

2 Likes

(I reply in full size, in between part of your copy pasted messages in reduced size)


	Once the project is built and you’re ready to export, here is a configuration that will work for you regardless of which recording format you choose on the G85:
	
	AlessandroExportSettings1614×416 33.2 KB
	Start with the “H.264 High Profile” preset and begin customizing the Advanced panels as shown in the picture. The items in red are the only ones requiring modification depending on your recording format:
	○ Resolution: Should be auto-filled by the project video mode
	○ Frames/sec: Should be auto-filled by the project video mode
	○ GOP: Use 240 for 60fps. Use 150 for 30fps.
	Once you’ve settled on a G85 recording format and the associated export settings, the export configuration can be saved as a custom preset by clicking the “+” Plus sign in the Preset panel. Then the custom preset can be used to export every video to ensure consistent results.

I agree, and while I was experimenting with different export settings my goal is to find one that works and stick to it. So your extra tips and explanation confirmed that! Thanks!
I actually had saved a profile for exporting, but I was taking care of it at the end of the editing process. And manually adjusting the presets, based on that video I told you about, sometimes changing one specs rather than other factor to see what would change in quality and space.

GOOD NEWS IS:
1. I was already using h.264 and
2. correcting the framerate and resolution.

LESS GOOD IS:
1. I was setting the GOP to half the framerate (for 60 fps to 30 and 15 for 30fps). I will definitely try with yours. Even if I read few articles about the GOP, I’m still confused what actually does or takes care of. What I read was very technical and difficult to make a sense out of it.


Rationale for these export settings (if curious):

Always curious! So far, using the settings suggested on that online tutorial (meaning FHD 60pfs, GOP 30, constant bitrate 40mega, dual pass activated, b-frame 2), it takes about 5 hours for a video of about 60 minutes, meaning I had to do overnight). I will try your new settings and hopefully it can be faster so I can also export during the day and catch up with the video exporting work. I would like to launch some on Patreon by the September 21st. Few people are asking for videos and waiting.

The recommendation you found of 40-50Mbps bitrate for 1080p is a good one for high-quality sources

I agree! I asked my self the same question why 40 if the source is in 28, and I guess I got misled, also not knowing the technical aspects of filming. So I’m really looking forward to use the CRF16/ 68% and post the result.


4K workflow possibilities:

Smoothness is a combination of two factors: frame rate and shutter speed.

I’ll test that, even if I’m not used to videogame on youtube :D. definitely deserves another test as you said and see if I will get both smooth and crisp results or only one of the two.

CAMERA CONFIGURATION
I was using the creative mode. I played with the metering mode, AF area, and exposure. After few videos it seems that :


• AF mode custom area. custom metering mode works better. Behind me I have a white wall and white shutters. When I move from standing and go seated or on the ground, sometimes the background became too much whitewashed. It seems that with custom metering and focus area that result is more stable.

• Even if I have two standing lights plus a standing house-lamp, I set the exposure in between +2/3 and +1 1/3 to have good clear white walls all around and have more contrasts with the dark colours of my clothes. I usually dress in dark colours to stand out on the background and to cover a little imperfection of the house’s floor and walls. Moreover there’s a big window-door on the side. So you might get a better idea of what’s happening :slight_smile:

• Automatic ISO
• WB= +1 to the right (which makes the colours more “intense” or expressive when I shoot indoor in the white living room. -1 or -2 when I shoot outside on the porch (otherwise the bushes around and the side of the house “attracts” the attention of the eye. I guess I’m getting picky. My wife doesn’t notice much difference but I’m happy to work toward quality improvements, at least right now that I’m experimenting.
• Multi metering. It seems to keep the “brightness”-whiteness of the background more stable while I’m moving from standing poses to on the ground ones.

The rest of the camera set up includes: tripod, ac power adaptor kit, PNY Elite-X simcard. The reason why I have a G85 is because I found it “as-new” on B&H for 450$ including the lens. PNY simcard seemed a good compromise considering I found it for 19$.


I have noticed that my G85 does continuous shooting but create files of 21 minutes each. Is it normal or I might have changed some setting by mistake? I cant’ decide if it’s a better thing having smaller files of 21min or not. It doesn’t seems to matter know, but actually it might be better in terms of uploading on the cloud and storing on the external hard drive. Nonetheless I recall that the first test video I took in 4k was one file of 60 minutes, I wonder what I might have changed.

TRANSFER WORK FLOW
I agree about the 2 hard drives and I have already thought about it, based on a bad experience of many years ago I have lost 1000 photos from a Trip in Polynesia because a brand new portable hard drive failed the same day I was formatting my pc. Pretty unlucky ah??!!!
So yesterday I found and ordered a second 4TB WD passport eternal hard drive. Found from the official WD store on Ebay for 74$, refurbished. I also just purchased 10TB cloud drive for 85$ for LIFE TIME for Degoo through Stack Social https://stacksocial.com/sales/degoo-premium-lifetime-backup-plans-10tb
It’s 100bucks but goes down to 85$ with a first purchase coupon code. (I think a browser plug-in as slickdeals.net should find it and apply it automatically. I can’t remember what I used). Degoo had a good mobile phone app, but not a dedicated pc app, nonetheless for that price I wouldn’t complain even if one had to manually upload the files using the browser. My idea is to store all files there too as cold-backup solution.

My laptop had a large-simcard reader in it, so it’s perfect. I use Teracopy as copy-software for windows and it goes pretty fast. It’s substitutes the built-in windows program for moving files. Try it if you don’t know it. It’s safer too.

Do you use the direct ethernet cable for uploading files? and If yes, do you notice any big difference over wifi? I know it does in download though. My laptop doesn’t have a ethernet port btw. And I have a 25mbt xfinity connection who’s pretty slow in uploading.

YOUR WORKFLOW and MINE
My goal is to publish 3 long videos per week (2 of a dynamic style + 1 of static-one). The idea is to have at least 2/3 weeks of video ready in advance, so whatever happens in my life I will be always ahead and have time to fix possible issues or enjoy a holiday, avoiding last minute anxiety and long nights until 5am working on editing and uploading. Eventually my workflow will be something like this, similar to yours:

Practicing-shooting in the morning or afternoon 2 or 3 long videos and if I will keep shooting in 1920x1080 I don’t need proxies so i might be able to edit them during the same day or the day after. I’m becoming better at the “acting part” so my editing is very simple: just cut out when i do mistakes or somebody enters the room by mistake (like gramma!). To speed it up I also found a good trick that works for me, but i’m open to better ones:

-I use the phone-stopwatch and a paper-notebook. Each time a “big mistake” happens (like I got confused with words or my gramma wife enters the room, which happen rarely btw) I write down the time of the event, so later, when I edit it’s easy to find it. It also guess it will also help me when I can’t edit the video on the same day. I’m saving the notes on the computer in case I will need them again.

Of course if i will shot in 4K i night to do the proxies overnight as you do. So one night can be dedicated to proxies and another to exporting.

2nd PC:
I have a second tiny notebook from an unknown Chinese brands. I installed Linux Mint on it and Shotcut too. it’s Celeron baed and with a M.2 Drive. Do you have any idea how can I use it to improve or speed up my workflow? I haven’t test it how long does it takes to export with your new settings. I will test on that too. here the specs:

Model: EZBOOK 3 PRO
CPU Clock speed: Quad Core 1.1GHz, up to 2.2GHz CPU clock
Chipset: Intel Celeron Processor N3450 or (Intel Apollo Lake N3450) Processor
Camera: Single Webcam with 2 MP front camera
Memory: RAM 6GB DDR3 | Storage 64GB eMMC Drives with 128GB TF Card Slot
https://www.amazon.com/Jumper-Pro-Computer-Notebook-Ultrabook/dp/B07842JY23

I guess if use the same settings in Shotcut I should have the same result and maybe be able to process some extra videos once in a while or some proxies. What do you think? I can use only during the afternoon and nights cause in the morning my kid uses it for online-school.

UPLOADING & STREAMING PLATFORMS
Due to creating the videos only for Patreons for now, it seems easier to upload them on Youtube and flagging the video as “private”. Any experience with it? I also see that Streamable comes pretty cheao at 10$/month.
When I will have a bigger amount of videos (about 70>100) all exported in the same way, I will create my own website-platform with Amazon AWS S3, uScreen.tv or something like that. Do you have any xperience with any of them or competitor? I’m reading a lot about them, but it’s a big topic. I know it’s not my main concern for now, but it seems that they reencode the videos to make them smaller and more easily streamable, so i would like to understand them better.

PS: after this long message I can wait to shoot a video in 4k with the new shutter speed settings and especially to export both the 4k one and the FHD one following your tips and see the results. I will during the next few days with a short clip first so it’s easier to manipulate it.

Thanks for these great chats, honestly they’re not only very useful but I’m pretty sure they will make a difference for my project and work, but it also making me very excited like I haven’t experienced in a while. Thanks for that!!!

EDITING
with a tripod, a static background, and the right brightness my editing it’s very simple. I use the “split option” and cut out the mistake. so i don’t use filters or any other clips beside the “main ones”, usually 3 or 4 (because as said the Lumix G85 breaks it like that).
the only extra track is the audio one: because i use audacity to amplify the audio and to clean the track from background noise and few things like that. so very basic.
this is how it look like in Shotcut.

stra

IMPORTANT UPDATE
PS: i have just exported one of the HD videos using the setting you suggested. it looks as good as with the old setting i was using (the one from the youtube tutorial) but it’s 1/3 of the size, so hopefully it’s small enough for the straming platforms. it took 3 to 4 hours to encode 1hour videos. So also about half the time. GREAT!
screenshot.47

here you can see the video exported with your settings. feel free to comment honestly. of course this cloud is just for storage.
https://cloud.degoo.com/share/CFWeY8W6mojoVD

let you know soon the result in 4K.

So thanks a lot!!

Still catching up a bit reading through things but the lack of fluid motion at 4k could certainly be due to that PNY card, V30 cards are going to struggle with 4k. I did a whole video on what all the various symbols mean a bit back while I was reviewing some microSD cards https://www.pocketables.com/2020/07/what-do-all-those-sd-symbols-mean.html

If this were GH5 4K at 400 Mbps All-I, then it would definitely be a concern. But this is G85 4K that tops out at 100 Mbps. V30 is plenty sufficient for a G85. If the card is unable to keep up with the camera’s writing speed, the G85 will immediately stop recording at the point of lag. It isn’t very resilient in this sense. So motion fluidity becomes in essence very binary… it’s either perfect or it’s nothing at all.

Even though the PNY should be fine for this task (in theory), to your point I’ve seen some cards fail at recording because they didn’t actually live up to their V30 speed rating when tested. I don’t know how the PNY stacks up in actual testing. For me, I’ve never had a failure with SanDisk Extreme Pro even after hundreds of hours of recording, so that has become my go-to card brand. This is mere personal experience and not exhaustive testing of every brand.